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Old 5th May 2010, 09:33 PM
Liguori Liguori is offline
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 34
Default Suffering and Patience.

St Philip Neri...."in this world there is no purgatory.
It is either all paradise or all hell.
He that patiently supports tribulations enjoys a paradise.
He that does not do so , suffers a hell."

Our Lord to St Gertrude..."My child thou canst do nothing more gratifying to me than to submit patiently to all the tribulations that befall thee."

St Mary Magdalene of Pazzi suffering on her death bed prayed for her life to be prolonged because in her own words.."in Heaven one can suffer no more."

St Augustine "One and the same blow lifts the good to glory , and reduces the bad to ashes."

It is obvious to me that following Jesus I am going to suffer.
It is also obvious to me that I must embrace this with patience and thanksgiving.

When I pray , I constantly ask for things that I think are good for me and my family. I presume you do the same.

Should we , following the saints , be praying for an increase in suffering and for the patience to endure it joyfully?

I appreciate your response.
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Old 6th May 2010, 01:34 PM
CB CB is offline
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 122

Imo, if I am trying to live my life in conformity to God's Will, then I have no need to seek additional suffering. Each day brings it's own problems and trials.
When you really stop to think about it, suffering can be found even in the most trivial things-like driving to and from work, reading the world news of the day, daily duties at home-even in sharing in the pain of those around us.
I think it is more wise to pray for the virtue of patience, that we may endure, with equanimity, the sufferings that will most assuredly come our way, as the Lord allows.
St. Alphonsis Ligouri wrote a wonderful book on conforming to the Will of God. Ron has it mentioned with the website on one of the threads.
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Old 6th May 2010, 02:06 PM
Ron Conte Ron Conte is offline
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 12,755

Originally Posted by Liguori View Post
Should we , following the saints , be praying for an increase in suffering and for the patience to endure it joyfully?

First, strive to avoid all sin. There can be much difficulty in this endeavor alone. Then strive to do the will of God, which includes accepting various crosses. Most persons do not have such a degree of holiness that, having accepted all the sufferings that result from avoiding sin, and from doing the will of God, they then ask for more sufferings. In any case, if you suffer more than is the will of God, you have not done more, but less.

{22:42} saying: “Father, if you are willing, take this chalice away from me. Yet truly, let not my will, but yours, be done.”
Ron Conte
Roman Catholic theologian
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Old 6th May 2010, 02:38 PM
Brother Brother is offline
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,801

God created us to be happy, so it is natural in our hearts that we want happiness.

The saints who requested God to 'suffer' more was because their level of holiness permitted them to feel happy on those situations because they knew that they were sharing with our Lord's Passion and that they were finding Paradise with it, and with the purpose of offering those sufferings for the conversion of the world or sinners in particular. Also, for the most part, the 'suffering more' was about a cross they already had, they requested more of it because they knew it was God the one sending those crosses to them (it was not a cross – or crosses – that they invented). It was not that they wanted to suffer for no reason or because they just wanted it (otherwise they would be crazy or insane people) but they wanted to suffer for the love of God they have and because they wanted to encounter our Lord thru these situations.

We should imitate the saints but we should also be seeking what is the Will of God in our particular lives, perhaps He want us to accomplish a particular task at this point in time, so requesting an illness that will not permit us to accomplish that task would not be fitting for us to look for. It is much better to do the Will of God than to offer Him sacrifices that go against His Will; that would even not be acceptable to Him.

How do we know how much He want us to suffer? being in communion with His grace and by the hardships we have now.

So, in our prayers, we should seek our well being (for He is our Good Father and He wants us to be happy!) but we should at the same time accept whatever is His will for us.

(As Ron also pointed out)
{26:42} Again, a second time, he went and prayed, saying, “My Father, if this chalice cannot pass away, unless I drink it, let your will be done.”

“Our Lord sends the crosses; we do not have to invent them.” – St. Padre Pio.
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Old 9th May 2010, 11:08 PM
Liguori Liguori is offline
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 34

I know the question I asked seems strange!
It was once raised in our group and kept us talking for ages.
So I wanted to ask it here.

Thank you CB,Ron and Brother...your insights underlined what we thought.
That all we can do is try to avoid sin then pray for the grace to deal with any hardship that follows.
Doing this is surely Gods Will.

The quote given by Brother from St Pio is very helpful..
"Our Lord sends the crosses...we do not have to invent them."

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Old 13th May 2010, 02:02 PM
garabandalg garabandalg is offline
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,686
Default Real value of suffering

It is human nature to avoid suffering, but we should be open and accepting to the Will of God including whatever crosses and suffering He may send us. Rather than see suffering as a cross, however, I would see it as an opportunity to be closer to Christ.
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