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  #1  
Old 3rd May 2007, 12:24 PM
Padraig
 
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Default General Sir Michael Rose

General Sir Michael Rose has some interesting things to say about the Iraq debacle:

General Sir (Hugh) Michael Rose, KCB CBE DSO QGM (born 1940 in what was then British India) is a retired British Army General. As well as commanding 22 SAS, his best-known - and most controversial within and outside the Army - appointment in the regular army was as Commander UNPROFOR Bosnia from 1994 to 1995 during the aftermath of the Yugoslav Wars.

"As Lord Chatham said, when he was speaking on the British presence in North America, he said 'if I was an American, as I am an Englishman, as long as one Englishman remained on American native soil, I would never, never, never lay down my arms'.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6618075.stm



Last edited by Padraig : 3rd May 2007 at 12:29 PM.
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  #2  
Old 3rd May 2007, 12:49 PM
CRW
 
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Padraig,

May the world come to recognize the day the blood shed by Americans for their own personal safety, their freedom, and their economic welfare? If America would fall back to isolation, not offer their noble man and woman to fight for freedom, I believe that Europe would be a land not separated by an ocean, but terrorist.

I am a man of peace, I donít support the original or current justification we state that we are in Iraq, but I do believe a greater evil is on the doorsteps, awaiting our withdrawal. Do not fear, it will happen in 2008, if not sooner, when the elections are over. History will bear the results in a few years after the withdrawal.

One only has to compare the difference in North Korea and South Korea. One is starving their people; one is a major economic resource.

Cecil
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  #3  
Old 3rd May 2007, 02:30 PM
Padraig
 
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Hi Cecil,

Its good to see you posting again, I hope you are keeping better.

I certainly agree with you when you hope that, 'May the world come to recognize the day the blood shed by Americans for their own personal safety, their freedom, and their economic welfare.

My own personal view is that the blood shed by brave American, British, Polish, Spanish, etc, boys and girls out may very well be for their own personal safety for they are in a hostile occupied country that hates and dislikes their presence more and more with each passing day.

I would be a little more dubious that the occupation of Iraq is for the 'freedom'. Originally it was claimed that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. This might indeed be argued endanger other countries peace, but there weren't in weapons of mass destruction and the Governments of both countries have admitted this. It might be well argued that if Iraq supported terrorism it might well endanger other nations. But in fact the secularist B'aath Party which Saddam Hussein led was vehemently opposed to Fundamentalist Islamic Forces and did its very best to suppress them. On the contrary one report by the British Intelligence Agency MI5 stated that the world risk from terrorism has substantially increased as a direct result of the Invasion and Occupation of Iraq.

As US troops were invading Iraq in March 2003, President George Bush announced that “our forces will be coming home as soon as their work is done.” But long afterwards, large numbers of US troops remain in Iraq and the president has not set a timetable or criteria for withdrawal, saying only that the troops will leave once they “complete the mission.”

But far from planning to withdraw, since 2003 the US military has been quietly constructing bases in Iraq . Government officials, including President George Bush, refuse to state publicly that the US has no plans to station troops in Iraq over the long term. This has led some analysts to speculate that the US wants to maintain a permanent military presence in Iraq for geo-strategic reasons, even if the number of US troops in Iraq decreases significantly.

You go on to point out that, 'If America would fall back to isolation, not offer their noble man and woman to fight for freedom, I believe that Europe would be a land not separated by an ocean, but terrorist.'

But lets look at what will happen if Iraq remains occupied, until President Bush's term of office is over. We will have massive US and British casualties both dead and wounded at a huge economic price. At the next election the Republican Party will be decimated at the polls as your President and his Party becomes daily more and more deeply unpopular with the American people. The US will withdraw and withdraw in the jaws of defeat. It not a matter of 'if' its simply a matter now of when. By leaving now hundreds, maybe thousands of American lives would be saved along with billions upon billions of tax payers money.

You say that, I am a man of peace, I don’t support the original or current justification we state that we are in Iraq, but I do believe a greater evil is on the doorsteps, awaiting our withdrawal.. But if he current Iraq 'Government' falls will it get much worse for US national interests? In the first place the legitimacy of the current Government is extremely questionable.In the elections in January 2005, in which some 8 million Iraqis voted was not in any sense of the Democratic wishes of the Iraqi people.. The vote, more over, was criticized for its lack of Sunni participation and an absence of international observers.

Basically the US and Britain are propping up a violent, sectarian Government that is falling to pieces anyway. Whether or not this happens now or later is irrelevant. The adventure is coming to an end. Why not now rather than later when much, much more blood will have been shed?

Last edited by Padraig : 3rd May 2007 at 02:50 PM.
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  #4  
Old 3rd May 2007, 07:13 PM
CRW
 
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Padraig,

Yes we are there for Iran IMHO, but that is another topic of itself. I do wish we would pull out and allow the world to see the results. There is an old poker saying, never show your trump card. But in this case, it may be better to just fold the hand and take the licking.

May I ask for your prayers for my daughter Ann who is in India now outsourcing some business. I fear for her there, I do not have a great feeling about this trip.

Cecil
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  #5  
Old 3rd May 2007, 07:44 PM
Padraig
 
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I will pray hard for you both Cecil to Our Lady over the next week.


Last edited by Padraig : 3rd May 2007 at 07:57 PM.
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  #6  
Old 3rd May 2007, 09:06 PM
untamed_angel
 
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Cecil

Please forgive me but If American and Britain had not gone into Iraq there would be no war.

Please note that Saddam is dead and yet the so called "war on terror" is very much alive. Why? Because the Terrorist is still alive and well,.....Bin Laden. So yes there will be more terror because Britain and America took it upon themselves to illegally invade Iraq. There will be consequences. Yes there will be more terror attacks because Bin Laden...one of the largest contributors to the American economy and their biggest enemy is still at large.
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  #7  
Old 4th May 2007, 12:16 AM
CRW
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by untamed_angel View Post
Cecil

Please forgive me but If American and Britain had not gone into Iraq there would be no war.

Please note that Saddam is dead and yet the so called "war on terror" is very much alive. Why? Because the Terrorist is still alive and well,.....Bin Laden. So yes there will be more terror because Britain and America took it upon themselves to illegally invade Iraq. There will be consequences. Yes there will be more terror attacks because Bin Laden...one of the largest contributors to the American economy and their biggest enemy is still at large.

You are correct. It made no difference how many of his own people he killed. Like Hitler, the world watched. BTW, the UN had approved and Iraq agreed yo rules that Iraq must follow after the first war. They failed to comply with the peace terms. The US did not dishonor the oeace agreement and had every right to invade because Iraq was firing on US aircraft protroling the protection area - they agreed too.

Don't get me wrong, I think the world deserves the US and Britain to pull out of Iraq. Please allow Iran to take over, control the oil, and set up killing fields as we saw in Cambodia. If you have read Ron's secrets, where do you think the war will emerge?

Cecil
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  #8  
Old 4th May 2007, 12:19 AM
CRW
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Padraig View Post
I will pray hard for you both Cecil to Our Lady over the next week.

Padraig,

It will be a few weeks but I will post when she is on her return flight. I truely appreciate the prayers. I received a call from her this afternoon and she so misses her twins sons.

Cecil
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  #9  
Old 9th May 2007, 09:24 PM
untamed_angel
 
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CRW

Bush and Blair "will never be able to wash the blood of the Iraqi men,women, children and soldiers of both sides from their hands". Bush and Blair lied their way into Iraq. Shame he didnt feel as strongly about his biggest enemy and financial source Bin Laden.

lol oh yes pull the soldiers out now. I mean there is nothing left of the country now. Generations of families wiped out, chaos, anarchy, starvation, disease, poverty are all rampant now. Saddam was a dictator but Bush and Blair are Bullies and murderers.

I believe what goes around comes around CRW and I personally believe that Iran and Iraq will stand together against the US and Britain. Will those who have condoned the murder and pillage of a country born of lies still be smiling.Still justifying. Still excusing such atrocious acts of violence. Oh no!!

Then America and Britain will be screaming terrorists, then the propoganda will be spilled over papers and tv's again and again and again just like they did as the the terrorists bush and blair prepared to go to war on innocents.
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