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  #31  
Old 18th May 2007, 06:24 AM
Padraig
 
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By offering up his own execution in atonement for his mortal sins he must have saved himself, i

God doesn't require such 'atonement' for forgiveness. He is not an accountant.
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  #32  
Old 18th May 2007, 08:56 AM
Justin Angel Justin Angel is offline
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Cool Correction: Genesis 4 and 9

Genesis 9 is the story of God's covenant with Noah. The story of Cain and Abel is Genesis 4.
I had the first murder ever committed in mind, sorry.

"For your own lifeblood, too, I will demand an accounting; from every animal I will demand it, and
from man in regard to his fellow man I will demand an accounting for human life. If anyone sheds
the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed;for in the image of God has man been made." {Genesis 9:5-6}

The imperative "shall" is in the passive tense, so what we find here may not necessarily be a divine
command but only divine sanction which may just as well be a direct command from God to justly
execute murderers.

Now, going back to Genesis 4, the story of Cain and Abel, we find scriptural verses which apparently
prohibit the use of the death penalty, according to many Christian theologians and clergy who
are opposed to capital punishment.

"What have you done! Listen, your brother's blood cries out to me from the soil. Therefore you shall be banned
from the soil that opened its mouth to receive your brother's blood from your hand...You shall become a restless
wanderer on the earth." Cain said to the Lord, "My punishment is too great to bear...anyone may kill me at sight."
"Not so!" the Lord said to him. "If anyone kills Cain, Cain shall be avenged sevenfold." So the Lord put a mark
on Cain, lest anyone should kill him on sight. {Genesis 4:10-15}

This passage does not appear to me to be a prohibition against capital punishment. When Cain expresses
his fear of "anyone" possibly killing him he has no legitimate judicial institution in mind. He is afraid of other murderers
like himself who would not hesitate to murder him out of a selfish motive. The prohibition in this passage is against
taking human life unjustly and without a divine mandate.
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  #33  
Old 18th May 2007, 12:14 PM
Ron Conte Ron Conte is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themilitantcatholic View Post
Ron, In regards to preparing for The Warning; our past sins of which we have confessed to a priest and made sufficient repentance in the eyes of God, is the slate now clean in considering these past sins, is it wrong for oneself to "beat themselves up" lamenting past sins that have been confessed and repented for? Is it only the sins that one may still be obstinate in or remain attached to that will cause great sorry during The Warning?
Doesn't satan want us to keep dwelling on past sins in order for us to fall again. By not remembering past sins, wouldn't it be easier for one to remain in a state of grace?

It is a mistake to put too much emphasis on past sins from which one has repented and been forgiven. To wipe the slate clean, one must also do penance. However, one should also keep in mind that one has fallen in the past, so as to remain humble and so as to avoid committing those sins again. Don't forget past sins, but don't dwell on them either.

I think that the Warning will emphasize sins from which we have not yet repented, since that is where grace is needed.
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  #34  
Old 18th May 2007, 12:21 PM
Ron Conte Ron Conte is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Padraig View Post
By offering up his own execution in atonement for his mortal sins he must have saved himself, i

God doesn't require such 'atonement' for forgiveness. He is not an accountant.

To be saved from mortal sins at the time of one's death, one must be repentance with a contrition based on love of God and neighbor.

The Church does teach each person, at the time of their death, to accept death as a punishment for sin. For it is because of sin that death came into the world. However, we do not save ourselves by dying; rather, Christ saved us by His death.
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