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  #31  
Old 4th January 2011, 08:34 PM
Brother Brother is offline
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Those people don't live by Faith, but by reason alone, that is not the way to follow Christ, their attitude is not Christ-like.

Jesus did honor His mother Mary for He said:

{15:4} ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and, ‘Whoever will have cursed father or mother shall die a death.’
{15:5} But you say: ‘If anyone will have said to father or mother, “It is dedicated, so that whatever is from me will benefit you,”
{15:6} then he shall not honor his father or his mother.’ So have you nullified the commandment of God, for the sake of your tradition.
{15:7} Hypocrites! How well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:
{15:8} ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
{15:9} For in vain do they worship me, teaching the doctrines and commandments of men.’ ”

These people are seeking things to be revealed to them by flesh and blood but not from the Father Himself.

{16:17} And in response, Jesus said to him: “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father, who is in heaven.

Jesus is alive today in His Church and modern day Pharisees are asking Him the same question they asked Him 2000 years ago, such as "Who revealed it to you?... "with what authority you say such things?", etc, etc....


They simply don't believe thise Words:

[John]
{14:17} the Spirit of Truth, whom the world is not able to accept, because it neither perceives him nor knows him. But you shall know him. For he will remain with you, and he will be in you.

{14:26} But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will suggest to you everything whatsoever that I have said to you.

Last edited by Brother : 4th January 2011 at 08:37 PM.
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  #32  
Old 6th January 2011, 07:54 PM
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The mere fact that the infallible New Testament books were selected by the Catholic Church's early fathers (Sacred Scripture that even Protestant denominations read and believe), confirms the infallible authority of the Church.

From the Catholic Encyclopedia:

"Scriptures for proof of the Church's infallible authority we appeal to them merely as reliable historical sources, and abstract altogether from their inspiration. Even considered as purely human documents they furnish us, we maintain, with a trustworthy report of Christ's sayings and promises; and, taking it to be a fact that Christ said what is attributed to Him in the Gospels, we further maintain that Christ's promises to the Apostles and their successors in the teaching office include the promise of such guidance and assistance as clearly implies infallibility. Having thus used the Scriptures as mere historical sources to prove that Christ endowed the Church with infallible teaching authority it is no vicious circle, but a perfectly legitimate logical procedure, to rely on the Church's authority for proof of what writings are inspired.

2
Merely remarking for the present that the texts in which Christ promised infallible guidance especially to Peter and his successors in the primacy might be appealed to here as possessing an a fortiori value, it will suffice to consider the classical texts usually employed in the general proof of the Church's infallibility; and of these the principal are:

•Matthew 28:18-20;
•Matthew 16:18;
•John 14, 15, and 16;
•I Timothy 3:14-15; and
•Acts 15:28 sq.
Matthew 28:18-20
In Matthew 28:18-20, we have Christ's solemn commission to the Apostles delivered shortly before His Ascension: "All power is given to me in heaven and in earth. Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost; teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world." In Mark 16:15-16, the same commission is given more briefly with the added promise of salvation to believers and the threat of damnation for unbelievers; "Go ye into the whole world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be condemned."

Now it cannot be denied by anyone who admits that Christ established a visible Church at all, and endowed it with any kind of effective teaching authority, that this commission, with all it implies, was given not only to the Apostles personally for their own lifetime, but to their successors to the end of time, "even to the consummation of the world". And assuming that it was the omniscient Son of God Who spoke these words, with a full and clear realization of the import which, in conjunction with His other promises, they were calculated to convey to the Apostles and to all simple and sincere believers to the end of time, the only reasonable interpretation to put upon them is that they contain the promise of infallible guidance in doctrinal teaching made to the Apostolic College in the first instance and then to the hierarchical college that was to succeed it.

In the first place it was not without reason that Christ prefaced His commission by appealing to the fullness of power He Himself had received: "All power is given to me", etc. This is evidently intended to emphasize the extraordinary character and extent of the authority He is communicating to His Church — an authority, it is implied, which He could not personally communicate were not He Himself omnipotent. Hence the promise that follows cannot reasonably be understood of ordinary natural providential guidance, but must refer to a very special supernatural assistance.

In the next place there is question particularly in this passage of doctrinal authority — of authority to teach the Gospel to all men — if Christ's promise to be with the Apostles and their successors to the end of time in carrying out this commission means that those whom they are to teach in His name and according to the plenitude of the power He has given them are bound to receive that teaching as if it were His own; in other words they are bound to accept it as infallible. Otherwise the perennial assistance promised would not really be efficacious for its purpose, and efficacious Divine assistance is what the expression used is clearly intended to signify. Supposing, as we do, that Christ actually delivered a definite body of revealed truth, to be taught to all men in all ages, and to be guarded from change or corruption by the living voice of His visible Church, it is idle to contend that this result could be accomplished effectively — in other words that His promise could be effectively fulfilled unless that living voice can speak infallibly to every generation on any question that may arise affecting the substance of Christ's teaching.

Without infallibility there could be no finality regarding any one of the great truths which have been identified historically with the very essence of Christianity; and it is only with those who believe in historical Christianity that the question need be discussed. Take, for instance, the mysteries of the Trinity and Incarnation. If the early Church was not infallible in her definitions regarding these truths, what compelling reason can be alleged today against the right to revive the Sabellian, or the Arian, or the Macedonian, or the Apollinarian, or the Nestorian, or the Eutychian controversies, and to defend some interpretation of these mysteries which the Church has condemned as heretical? "

Quote:
One may not appeal to the inspired authority of the Scriptures, since for the fact of their inspiration the authority of the Church must be invoked, and unless she be infallible in deciding this one would be free to question the inspiration of any of the New Testament writings

----------------

For complete article see here.

Last edited by Brother : 6th January 2011 at 07:59 PM.
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  #33  
Old 6th January 2011, 10:10 PM
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Default Proof of papal infallibility from Holy Scripture

First infallible declaration given to Peter exclusively:

{16:13} Then Jesus went into parts of Caesarea Philippi. And he questioned his disciples, saying, “Who do men say that the Son of man is?”
{16:14} And they said, “Some say John the Baptist, and others say Elijah, still others say Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
{16:15} Jesus said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”
{16:16} Simon Peter responded by saying, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
{16:17} And in response, Jesus said to him: “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father, who is in heaven.


Quote:
Luke 22:31-32
Here Christ says to St. Peter and to his successors in the primacy: "Simon, Simon, behold Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and thou, being once converted, confirm thy brethren." This special prayer of Christ was for Peter alone in his capacity as head of the Church, as is clear from the text and context; and since we cannot doubt the efficacy of Christ's prayer, it followed that to St. Peter and his successors the office was personally committed of authoritatively confirming the brethren — other bishops, and believers generally — in the faith; and this implies infallibility.

Last edited by Brother : 6th January 2011 at 10:19 PM.
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  #34  
Old 3rd June 2011, 07:26 AM
myLivingBread myLivingBread is offline
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These was asked by evangelicals :I know that there are at least eight ( dogmas namely:

1. Mother of God
2. Immaculate Conception
3. Perpetual Virginity
4. Assumption
5. Mother of the Church
6. Co-Redemptrix
7. Co-Mediatrix
8. Queen of Heaven and Earth

So, my questions are the following:

1. Are these dogmas imposed by the Vatican will be a 'great threat' against the faith of the Catholic Church? Why or why not?

2. What will be the effects of the dogmas of Mary for the Catholic believers?

3. What will happen to the Christocentricity of the Roman Catholic Church?

4. Is the Roman Catholic Church facing a 'Marian Era'?

5. If there is such thing, what will be the next Marian dogma sounds like? Is the next dogma will be like 'Queen of queens' and 'Lady of ladies' or stuff?

6. Does Mariology affects Soteriology, to be general, the salvation of Christians?
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  #35  
Old 3rd June 2011, 12:06 PM
Ron Conte Ron Conte is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myLivingBread View Post
1. Mother of God
2. Immaculate Conception
3. Perpetual Virginity
4. Assumption
5. Mother of the Church
6. Co-Redemptrix
7. Co-Mediatrix
8. Queen of Heaven and Earth

Mary's role as co-Redemptrix, Mediatrix, Advocatrix is not a dogma. At best, it is the ordinary teaching of the Magisterium.

3. What will happen to the Christocentricity of the Roman Catholic Church?

6. Does Mariology affects Soteriology, to be general, the salvation of Christians?


Mary's role is always to immerse herself entirely in Christ, to worship Him, and to assist Him in all that He does for our salvation.

II. Partial List of Dogmas about the Virgin Mary

1. Her Immaculate Conception
(Papal Infallibility: 1854 - Pope Pius IX, Ineffabilis Deus)
2. Her Sinless Life: a gift from God distinct from her freedom from original sin
(Tradition and the Universal Magisterium)
3. Her Perpetual Virginity
(Tradition and the Universal Magisterium)
4. Mary as the Mother of God (Theotokos or God-bearer)
(Magisterium: A.D. 431 - Council of Ephesus; 681 - Third Council of Constantinople)
5. Mary as the Spouse of the Holy Spirit
6. Mary as the perfect disciple of Christ
7. Mary as the Mother and figure of the Church
(Scripture: John 19:26-27, and Tradition)
8. Her Participation in the Passion of Christ
(Tradition, Scripture, Magisterium)
9. Her Assumption to Heaven
(Papal Infallibility: 1950 - Pope Pius XII, Munificentissimus Deus)
10. Her Queenship in Heaven
(Tradition: as explained in Ad Caeli Reginam)

III. Partial List of Truths about the Virgin Mary not yet Defined as Dogma

1. Her miraculous virgin conception and miraculous virgin birth
2. Her triune role co-Redemptrix, Mediatrix, Advocatrix
3. Her Death and Resurrection (i.e. her Dormition)
4. Her Return at the Second Coming of Christ

http://www.catholicplanet.com/mariology.htm
__________________
Ron Conte
Roman Catholic theologian
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  #36  
Old 3rd June 2011, 02:36 PM
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Some of these dogmas are implicitly stated in Sacred Scripture:

1. Mother of God

Jesus is God and Mary is His mother.

5. Mother of the Church

It is clearly stated in Sacred Scripture that Christ is the Head of His Church (Colossians 1:18 "And he is the head of his body, the Church") , that we are part of His Mystical Body (1 Cor 12:19 ff), and God chose to have a Mother (Luke 1:30-13); therefore, Mary is our mother as well. Mary can not be the Mother of a "head" or of one part of a body only.

8. Queen of Heaven and Earth

Jesus is the King of kings (Rev 17:14), and every knee shall bow at His Name, in Heaven, Earth and in Hell (Philippians 2:10) and since this same King has a Mother (because He willed so), that Mother must be a Queen. "The mother of a king is a queen".
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